Nancy Colby Shockey of Glendale, AZ writes: PLEASE be advised that this is NOT the complete lineage from Charlemagne to Anthony Colby, that was listed in a book. This was the lineage listed in one chapter of the book. There are other chapters that go back from Elizabeth FitzAlan to Charlemagne. This is NOT my work I just saw it on Ancestry.com and wanted to throw it out there for discussion.

Pedigrees of Some of the Emperor Charlemagne's Descendants. Volume II (http://www.ancestry.com/search/db.aspx?dbid=48069&enc=1) viewed at ancestry.com (http://www.ancestry.com/).

This book was dedicated to Aileen Lewers (Mrs. William Carroll) Langston when she was the President General of the Order of the Crown of Charlemagne in the United States of America. She died on August 15, 1971. Dedicated by Hiram Kennedy Douglass, Chaplain General, Florence, Alabama Dec 23, 1972.

Chapter XIX

Charlemagne

Elizabeth FitzAlan m: Sir Robert Goushill

Elizabeth Goushill m: Sir Robert Winfield

Elizabeth Winfield m: Sir William Brandon

Elizabeth Brandon m: John Garnon (Gernon)

Thomas Garnon (aka Candyshe) m: Agnes

Augustine Garnon (aka Candyshe) m: Elizabeth

Sir Richard Garnon (aka Candyshe of Grymston Hall) m: Eliabeth Grymston

Richard Candyshe m: Beatrice Golde

Mary Candyshe m: Thomas Felton

Beatrice Felton m: Thomas Colby, of Beccles, Suffolk and Roos Hall

Anthony Colby, 4th son of Thomas Colby, Beccles Parish, Suffolk, ca. 1580; d: Feb 11, 1660 in Mass. Married Susanna Haddon, d: July 8, 1689.

Gordon Crooks writes: I have always said that I felt Anthony Colby was related to Roos Hall, Beccle Colby's as the distance was not too great and 2nd or later sons always left the manor place for a spot on their own. What sort of cements this is both Thomas Colby (1st son) and Anthony Colby BOTH had Felton parents (female ) To me that's just too much of a coincidence.

Rena McCarthy writes: Wow, looks like you got exciting information! I definitely agree with you - very great coincidence not to be true. I had a look on britishorigins website and saw there are Colby and Felton inheritance disputes going back in time and you can see a few people took the Norfolk line to court. There are also some surviving wills. I've pasted the full lists below and you can pick out the Norfolk lines and the Wills made in "foreign parts". Wonder what dispute the fellow called Sir William Withypole had with the norfolk Feltons. For your information, Suffolk county is just below Norfolk county and quite a few people travelled south and back north no problem - they probably sailed because it was quickest way to go.

Inheritance Disputes Index 1574-1714

Search criteria: Last name: COLBY Close variants Year range: 1574 to 1714

Burton Richard Downham Hall, NORFOLK Vincent v. Colby 1644 C10/46/191

Colby Lyon London Colby v. Colby 1651 C8/100/39-40, 102/67, 72

Coleby George Oxford Coleman v. Ryland 1676 C5/419/89

Coleby Hartford Layer Marney, Essex Eldred v. Coleby 1659 C10/100/40

Coleby James Welham, Yorkshire Garnett v. Coleby 1692 C8/346/177

Coleby John Middleham, Yorkshire Coleby v. Milbanke 1699 C5/283/63

Coleby John Thursley, Surrey Dudman v. Coleman 1713 C5/603/98

Coleby William Shotteswell, Warwickshire Coleman v. Coleman 1699 C5/202/15

England Thomas Saxthorpe, NORFOLK England v. Colby 1681 C5/477/22, 23

Leades Edmund NORFOLK Wiscard v. Colby 1707 C5/278/34

Loader Edmund London Bateman v. Coleby 1711 C10/412/10

Salmon Isabel widow Barton Grange, Nottinghamshire Pickworth v. Colby 1640 C8/73/65

Inheritance Disputes Index 1574-1714

Search criteria: Last name: FELTON Close variants Year range: 1574 to 1714

Bradshaw George Bradshaw v. Felton 1657 (A) C5/401/3

Dager William Sugden, Shropshire Felton v. Felton 1664 C8/325/143

Dager William Sugden, Shropshire Baldwyn v. Felton 1665 C8/318/27

Felton Daniel London Felton v. Wood 1629 C8/68/113

Tollemach Thomas Ireland Stewart v. Felton 1695 C5/296/76

Withypole William Sir Norwich, NORFOLK Devereux v. Felton 1645 C7/405/5

Prerogative Court of Canterbury Wills Index 1717-1845

COLBY Thomas Kent England March 1751

COLEBY Richard Surrey England November 1753

COLBY Dixon Northamptonshire England December 1756

COLBY Dover NORFOLK England January 1758

COLBY Elizabeth Kent England November 1758

COLBY Charles Suffolk England March 1772

COLBY Nathaniel NORFOLK England August 1772

COLBY Samuel NORFOLK England July 1779

COLBY Stephen Pembrokeshire Wales June 1779

COLBY Thomas London England January 1781

COLBY Robert foreign parts July 1784

COLBY Jane Pembrokeshire Wales April 1787

COLEBY James foreign parts June 1788

COLBY Nathaniel NORFOLK England September 1793

COLBY Johannah London England March 1796

COLBY Mary Essex England December 1799

FELTON Jonathan Middlesex England July 1750

FELTON Daniel foreign parts November 1759 ….FOREIGN PARTS

FELTON Margaret Middlesex England December 1759

FELTON Martha Middlesex England May 1763

FELTON John London England December 1764

FELTON Thomas Suffolk England December 1769

FELTON James Suffolk England October 1775

FELTON John George Middlesex England February 1780

FELTON John foreign parts September 1781 …….FOREIGN PARTS

FELTON Mary Kent England December 1781

FELTON William foreign parts August 1781 ……..FOREIGN PARTS

FELTON William Middlesex England January 1781

FELTON Elizabeth Middlesex England December 1786

FELTON Humphry Shropshire England January 1790

FELTON John Middlesex England March 1796

Ron Colby of Kearns, UT writes: In 1895 James W. Colby published the book "History of the Colby Family" In his book he had the linage of Anthony Colby following the Thomas Colby and Beatrice Felton line. Many, many authors and researchers jumped onto this without doing their own research. One of his conclusions was that not much was known about Anthony Colby s/o Thomas and Beatrice so he was probably the one who came to America.

The very first author to question this was David W. Hoyt in his book "Old Families of Salisbury and Amesbury." in the early 1900's. In the 1970's several other authors questioned where Anthony came from. Glade Ian Nelson published an article in Apr 1975 in "The American Genealogist" with his finding about Anthony's origins.

One of the points of Glade Nelson finding was the will of his brother Phillip (1643) which leaves some money to his brother Anthony and Anthony's son Thomas in 1643. Yes, our Anthony Colby had a son Thomas, but he wasn't born until 1650, so how could Philip Colby leave money to Anthony's son in 1643 if he wasn't born until 1650. Looks like Anthony Colby s/o Thomas and Beatrice was still in England in 1643.

You can find Glade Nelson's and several other articles on my website in Anthony's notes.

Another point I must bring out about James W. Colby. In his book he has his line, which is incorrect. How can one put much faith in his book if he can't get his own linage correct.

Several years ago I ran into Gary Boyd Roberts at the Family History Library in Salt Lake City when he was here with an NEHGS tour. Mr Roberts wrote "The Royal Descents of 600 Immigrants to the American Colonies or the United States: Who Were Themselves Notable or Left Descendants Notable in American History". I ask him about the ancestry of Anthony and he told me "No way is Anthony Colby of Massachusetts from the Beccles line."

Kate Forster writes: How come nobody is mentioning Threllfall? I thought "we" had bought his analysis.

Matthew Colby b. abt 1530 & Mary

Thomas Colby & Anne (Agnes) Jackson b. abt 1571 m. 4 May 1596, Horbling, Lincoln, England

Anthony Colby b. Chr 8 Sep 1605, Horbling, Lincolnshire, England d. 11 Feb 1660/1661, Amesbury, MA & Mrs. Susannah Waterman d. 8 Jul 1689, Amesbury, MA m. abt 1632

Isn't that the accepted lineage?

Helene Haw writes: I agree with you, Kate…and wonder why no one else has replied to you. It's the will of Thomas Colby that convinced me.

THE WILL OF THOMAS COLBIE of Horbling10 December

1625---the will of Thomas Colbie of Horbling, County of Lincoln, taylor, sick of body…to my five sons William Colbie, Richard Colbie, Anthony Colbie, Mathew Colbie and Robert Colbie half of my good to be equally divided amongst them, but my will is that my son William Colbie shall have my house at Donington for part of his portion of goods aforesaid, which cost me eight pound…if any of these my sons die before age 21 at which time the legacies shall be due unto them, then his or their shares to be divided amougst the overlivers. Residue to wife Agnes Colbie whom I make executrix. Robert Allen supervisor.

Witnesses: Rob't Allen, Thomas Baxter. Signed by mark. Proved 21 April 1626. (Lincoln Consistory Court Wills 1626/292)

Nowhere is there any mention of Anthony or Matthew [in England] after their father's will of 1625.

Guy I. Colby IV of Irving, TX writes: Kate is correct -- John Brooks Threlfall's brilliant analysis of the true origin of the immigrant Anthony Colby is now considered definitive, and his identification of the Lincolnshire lineage has been accepted by The Great Migration Begins project. I met Threlfall at the 2001 Colby Reunion, and he gave me a copy of his article.

Not having researched the Suffolk Colby line, I cannot say whether the royal lineage which Nancy cites has been verified. Tristan Salazar is the expert on the English Colbys -- I believe he has identified something like half a dozen separate Colby families in Britain, including one in Wales. Whether they had a common ancestor is anyone's guess.

Gordon Crooks writes: Up until now I have held my peace and thinking on the subject. It is my opinion that the Colby's of Horbling and Beccles are the same family, albeit maybe separated by a generation or two. In my research of other families related to me, I have found this to be true. I am sure that all five Crooks families living Antrim, N. Ireland in 1660 were related and many of them came to Pennsylvania in the early 1700s. In my Moorehead line we recently found a 1850's burial in Antrim which establishes the link of the Pennsylvania Moorheads with the Ireland one, and then back to Scotland, and all the way back to Denmark (Vikings). Our family crest is on the tombstones. Coincidence? I think not. Remember, first sons inherited, second and later sons were provided for in the wills and for the most part went off on their own. This also happened here in the early generations and was the custom of the day. So all the Colby's are related and go back to the original one, whoever he was.

Ron Colby of Keanrs, UT writes: here is part of the Threlfall article.

"Thomas COLBY was baptized on 20 December 1567 at Sempringham, Lincolnshire, England. On 4 May 1596 at Horbling, he and Anne Jackson were married. she was born probably about 1571 the daughter of Richard and Elizabeth Jackson of Horbling. There are no surviving baptismal records for Horbling from 1567 through 1575. In Thomas's will she is called Agnes, but at that time, Anne and Agnes were often used interchangeably, as Elizabeth and Betty are today.

Horbling is about two miles north of Sempringham.

Thomas Colby was usually designated as "junior" to distinguish him from his elder brother, also named Thomas. From his will and the burial record, we learn that he was a tailor. He made his will 10 December 1625 and was buried 11 December 1625 as "Thomas Colby, jun., taler." His wife survived him.

10 December 1625 - the will of THOMAS COLBIE of Horbling, county of Lincoln, taylor, sick of body…. to my five sons William Colbie, Richard Colbie, Anthony Colbie, Mathew Colbie and Robert Colbie half of my goods to be equally divided amongst them, but my will is that my son William Colbie shall have my house at Dinnington for part of his portion of goods aforesaid, which cose me eight pound… if nay of these sons die before age 21 at which time the legacies shall be due unto them, then his or their shares to be divided amongst the overlivers. Residue to wife Agnes Colbie whom I make executrix. Robert Allen supervisor. Wienesses; Robert Allen. Thomas Baxter. Signed by mark. Proved 21 April 1626.

In March 1636/7, an assessment was made for expenses of repairing the church at Horbling. Thirty seven names were listed. William Colby, who had a small stock of animals, must have been the older brother. The widow Colby must have been their mother. Robert was mentioned for having been paid for some work. Nowhere is there any mention of Anthony or Matthew after their father's will of 1625. Possibly both of these brothers left for America with the Winthrop Fleet in 1630, but if so, there is no trace of Matthew. His fate will probable remain a mystery. As for Anthony, he is surely the one who went to New England in 1630. All the other know contemporary Anthony Colbys in Old England can be eliminated from consideration for one reason or another."

"Assessment agreed upon the fifth of March 1636 for the church wardens for the repairing of the church of Horbling and other duties by us whose names are here under written - Mathias Browne, William Stringer, John Hardie, with others. Every horse 7d., every beast 7d., and every score of sheep 2s 4d. horsebeastsheep

William Coulbe 1453s.6d.

Widow Coulby 1503s.6d."

(Ref.: Lincoln Consistory Court Wills - 1626/292)

Guy I. Colby IV of Irving, TX writes: Gordon -- You may well be correct. Despite John Brooks Threlfall's offhand dismissal of the Norfolk/Suffolk Colby line as "quite unrelated" to the Lincolnshire group, he offers no argument to support this statement (a surprising omission for a usually meticulous genealogist). Glade Ian Nelson showed conclusively in his 1975 "American Genealogist" article that the immigrant Anthony Colby was not the son of Thomas Colby, esq., and his second wife, Beatrice Felton, and Threlfall's article advances overwhelming evidence that he was in fact the son of Thomas Colby Jr. and Anne (Agnes) Jackson of Horbling. Nevertheless, nothing that Nelson or Threlfall puts forward precludes a connection between the two families -- after all, Beccles is only 80 odd miles southeast of the Horbling/Sempringham/Pointon area. Even though no link between these two Colby families has been established, it should be remembered that "the absence of evidence is not evidence."

If there is a connection, however, it may lie a little further back than a generation or two. Threlfall has discovered Colbys in Pointon and Sempringham as early as 1421, almost two centuries before the 1605 birth of the immigrant Anthony Colby. I have not seriously investigated the ancestry of Thomas Colby, esq., of Beccles, but a quick Google search suggests that his forebears were in Brundish (a Suffolk town about 15 miles southwest of Beccles) for several generations. The tombstone of his father, John Colby, esq. (d. 1540), is in the St. Lawrence churchyard in Brundish.

The question of whether there was a single common ancestor for all of the half dozen or so Colby groups in Britain is a bit more problematical. Tristan Salazar has pointed out that although the surname is not frequently encountered, it is widely distributed, and not all of the locations fall within the Danelaw region. Remember, too, that the history of the Scandinavian invasions is quite complicated, and it is entirely possible that more than one of the Danish and Norse raiders who arrived in the 150 years between the end of the 8th century and the middle of the 10th could have been a Colby progenitor. Unfortunately, it is all speculation -- there simply are no relevant extant records from that period. The first recorded mention of the Colby surname does not show up until the end of the 12th century.

Anthony Colby's Pedigree?